Over the weekend I went to the BlogHer 09 conference in Chicago with Clara in tow. While BlogHer has worked hard to create a culture that’s inclusive of moms and children — providing on-site child care, nursing stations, and allowing moms to bring little ones into the sessions — I still felt a little uncomfortable about the idea and asked several times on Twitter if other attendees would be bringing their babies everywhere with them, including the evening parties.
As it turned out, I wasn’t the only one confused. There was an incident with an exclusive, invitation-only party thrown by Nikon that turned out to be at a no-babies-allowed bar. At least one invitee didn’t ask ahead of time whether babies were welcomed, and was “disinvited” to the party when she showed up with her infant.
Now, I’m not going to get into all the ins and outs of whether this was a smart move on Nikon’s part or not. I think you could make a strong argument, as Katie Granju did, that more attention paid to the needs of a percentage of the invitees would have made for a much more successful event. And you could also argue, as Kristen Chase did, that the mom(s) in question really should have asked whether babies were welcome before they accepted the invitation, instead of just assuming they would be.
But in reading the posts and the ensuing comments, it became clear that there’s another issue at hand here: a significant number of people seem offended by the very idea of babies being “out”. Out at parties, out at the movies, out at night, out at a conference…you name the venue and it seems like there’s somebody who believe it’s no place for babies to be. And everybody’s opinions differ: some feel it’s OK for a baby-in-arms to be out at parties but not past a certain time of night; others believe that quiet babies are no big deal at any event but toddlers are another story; and some seem to feel that anywhere adults congregate, children should not. Obviously there’s no one standard social norm here, and I think most of us moms are just trying to gauge each situation as we can, based on our child’s age, disposition and the event at hand.
I’ve spent much of the last 11 years of my life mothering babies, and I believe it’s absolutely necessary to my happiness to be out in the world…whether with my kids or without. Thing is, it’s not always possible for a mom to be out in the world without children, especially when you’re traveling to a strange city, or are on a limited budget, or when you have a tiny baby.
I also think that I have a right to be out in the world with my children. They are small humans, not snakes or dogs. I’ve been glared at while eating dinner at 5 PM on an outside patio at a not-that-fancy restaurant with a small, quiet baby. Maybe the glaring patrons had had a bad experience while sitting next to a mom and a baby before. On the other hand, I was at a restaurant once where a boorish middle-aged man ruined my dinner by making loud racist remarks between bites. Would it be fair for me to glare at all middle-aged men I see while eating out?
But while I believe moms have the right to be out in the world — which sometimes means being out in the world with our children — I also believe we have responsibilities. We have to be conscientious about where we take our children, and when, and why, and for how long. We have to consider the needs of the host, the other guests, and our kids.
After reading Steph’s post about bringing her baby to BlogHer, and thinking over the comments I’d read on Kristen’s and Katie’s posts, I spent a little while feeling uncomfortable with my decision to take Clara along to the conference (as well as a handful of the after-hours parties). After all, from reading the comments it’s easy to see that a lot of people thought it was a bad mom move.
After dwelling on it for about 20 minutes, though, I realized I don’t care what those commenters think. I didn’t make the choice lightly. I’d taken into consideration Clara’s needs and disposition and the events I’d be attending, and made sure we had an exit plan in case things didn’t go well. I attended three cocktail parties, and never once shoved Clara in anyone else’s face–I didn’t have to, as most people seemed delighted that she was there. As far as the argument that babies can’t handle flashing lights or a loud atmosphere — has anyone been to a Chuck E Cheese, family wedding, zoo, or house with five kids recently? Babies aren’t as fragile as we seem to think they are. I’m all for keeping life calm for my baby, but a once-in-a-while disruption of her schedule and some extra chaos isn’t going to do her harm. Anyway, once she showed signs of having had enough, we left.
Looking back, I feel I made a responsible and conscientious choice, and while it might not have flown with everyone in the room, I’m personally OK with that. We can’t please everyone all of the time, and while we have to take other people’s feelings into account, that doesn’t mean we have to shrink away entirely in order to avoid possibly facing the judgment of anyone, ever, at any time. (Hint: It’s impossible).
Then again, I’m reminded of the time that I was sitting in a nice restaurant in Chicago—out by myself, sans kids, for the first time in months—and had to listen to a toddler at the table next to mine loudly whining, “Noooooo! Nooooooooo! Noooooooooooooo!” for at least ten minutes. When I glanced over at the parents, they seemed oblivious to the fact that other diners were shifting uncomfortably in their seats and sighing loudly over their $35 plates of Ahi Tuna.
In my opinion, the problem really isn’t babies. It’s clueless adults on both sides of the spectrum. While I think the majority of moms are aware of the effect their kids are having on the general public around us, it only takes one bad experience—a toddler running amok in a fancy restaurant; a relentlessly fussing baby in a movie theater—to give people the impression that not only are all kids loud and obnoxious, but most parents don’t care.
On the other hand, if you’ve done your duty as a conscientious parent — checking with your host, considering your baby’s needs and giving yourself an exit plan — you can relax. It’s not worth feeling vaguely guilty that you’ve violated some social norm that nobody can even agree on.
After all, one of the rules of happy motherhood is making the best choice you can at any given moment, and then moving on with confidence. That applies whether you’re trying to decide how long to breastfeed, whether or not to use time-outs…whether or not to bring your baby into a bar.
Edited to add: And you know what? Even if you look back and realize that bringing your child to X event probably wasn’t the best choice, move on with confidence anyway. We all make mistakes and do things we later realize weren’t such a great idea, and most of us learn from our missteps. The surest way NOT to be a happy mom is to spend too much time worrying about how people who don’t even know us feel about our choices. Besides, unless your baby projectile vomits on somebody else’s $200 blouse, they’ve probably forgotten all about him the minute you’re out of sight, anyway.
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“The problem really isn’t babies. It’s clueless adults on both sides of the spectrum.”
Hear, hear!
On another note, I have never been to BlogHer and I will probably never go. The Angry Mommy Bloggers scare me — if it isn’t Johnson & Johnson, it’s Motrin, or Nikon, or or or … I’ve been on the blogging side, and I’ve also been on the corporate PR side, and while yes, the PR types definitely need to think more about their market, the Angry Mommy Bloggers could also be more understanding.
Ugh. The whole thing upsets me, more than it should. I just can’t wade into those waters!
Hmmmmm…as a mom, I understand being hurt at being turned away simply for bringing your baby to an event…an event where perhaps the company should have thought more about their demographic. On the other hand, I think as moms we have a responsibility to understand that some events are “moms only” and that’s okay.
My husband and I just attended a wedding 2 weeks ago…the invitation was addressed only to us. I knew when I got married, when I addressed the invites to just the parents and didn’t say “and family” I meant just the parents. Many people didn’t listen, and we had a children’s reception for all the kids, which was great. But I knew what I really intended. So we left our 11 month old with the grandparents.
I think it’s perfectly acceptable to have some events be “adults only.” I think it’s important for us as parents to have moments that are “adult only” and leave our kids with family or friends during those times.
I never want to be the parent who people are rolling their eyes about because I’m always showing up to some adult function, dragging my child along.
My daughter is unbelievably well-behaved and slept so much when she was little, and I wore her, that we could take her anywhere and people would barely even notice…still there were some things we chose to stay home from, because we knew it was adults only.
I really think people have a right to say “no kids allowed.” And when that happens, for the most part, I decide to just stay away too, because I’d rather be with my daughter:)
I think in this instance, moms who chose to bring their babies with them to the conference should have perhaps realized that some sacrifices would go along with that…no cocktail parties perhaps? I get that it was a woman’s conference, but it wasn’t a “mommy conference with kids everywhere” so there were going to be events for just grown-ups.
Cara, I absolutely agree that people should be able to make their own rules about who is invited to their events and parties. That’s why I stressed in several places that part of being a conscientious parent is checking with a host first to make sure bringing a baby is OK. And as a mom who did BlogHer with a baby and skipped most of the parties in favor of a small handful that were more baby-friendly, I definitely agree that when you go somewhere with a child, sacrifices must be made.
What I’m talking about here is a general dislike for seeing babies out, even at places they are welcome and specifically allowed to be. I always knew the sentiment was out there, but reading comments at other sites, it became clear that it is a lot more prevalent than I’d originally thought.
Section 10 of the Illinois Breastfeeding law states that a women has the right to have her breastfeeding baby with her wherever she has the legal authority to be. That includes the cocktail party you were invited to. You do not need to ask permission to follow what is your legal right under state laws
It’s not an openly debatable issue anymore, it’s a law that protects women and children from all this back and forth on blogs about this party.
Megan
As we are all seeing on these blog comments, here and on Katie’s blog is that the USA is the mother, and baby and breastfeeding unfriendly country. That is why we needed state laws to give women the right to take our breastfed baby with us out in public.
Our reality is that the USA is all lip service to family values,and children.
Most People like children and mothers in theory only.
After seeing your comment, Megan, at Adventures in Babywearing I came over. As I wrote over there I have brought babies to conferences & left them at home; these were not blogging (I haven’t been to a blogging conference yet) but academic conferences. From my experience it is the minority not the majority that are bothered by babies/children being at these events.
From my perspective, given that this was a conference that in part was to help women who write for a living, I see this as a teaching & learning moment. For everyone to discuss more about the reality that women as mothers are trying to balance career & family, that the private & public spheres are no longer as clear cut, and that as we move forward in today’s culture we will have more areas of business that there are going to be times moms & their children are both present in these types of settings. I’m talking about the conference in general not the bar, although this is also a discussion that should happen when planning events on behalf of outside companies for conference participants.
As for those who are just bothered by children being out in public regardless the location, I’m sorry. Children are part of society & that’s not going to change.
I wasn’t at BlogHer, although I was on twitter & blogs reading about the baby/no-baby debate. Personally, I wouldn’t have taken my baby to BlogHer…but really because I’d rather stick needles in my eyes than juggle my son on an airplane. I took my infant son really everywhere as an infant. I was nursing & he was always in my sling. Granted, I wasn’t attending swanky cocktail parties, just friend & work parties & a few family weddings. (I got babysitters for the few parties that were adult only…I always asked in advance after I didn’t bring my son & the host was upset that she didn’t get to play with my baby.)
Now that my son is TWO, we only attend casual BBQ’s where he can play with other kids. While he was a dreamy, sleeping baby in my sling, he is now a high energy busy boy—we joke that we did not get the mellow child, so now fancy parties or restaurants for us for a while. That being said, I have friends with perfectly mellow toddlers that go with them everywhere and quietly read and play with their cars and never say a peep. They just have different temperaments and energy levels.
Now, occasionally, I plan badly. I take my toddler to a quick errand or whatever that ends up being a 2 hour waiting line, (think DMV where I got stuck last year). And, then I feel like the really insensitive and uncaring mom for subjecting my child to endless boredom and subjecting everyone else in the room with a crazy, loud toddler.
I do like seeing everyone’s thoughts and am always wistful for those days of my uber portable baby.
Sorry to double post, but I agree that there is also a regional aspect & I’d suggest even a cultural/socio-economics aspect too about where babies/children should/shouldn’t go. Similar to a lot of the discussion on what mothering or parenting should look like there is an undercurrent based on our own experiences.
It makes so much sense that this topic was stirred up from the conference (I didn’t go), because there is such a disparity of belief amongst people concerning children.
I was first a little shock that people would think it odd to bring nurslings to a women’s blog conference. I think so much of the skyrocketing ppd we are seeing with mom’s comes from the lack of support. So to have a new babe who you are attempting to stay in a healthy nursing relationship and then be not included in a women’s conference? Doesn’t sound like great support from the larger community.
I went to the Northern Californian Women’s Symposium right after I had my first baby. It was not a traditional conference, but what shocked me was the lack of cattiness and the support I received from the women with no children, older children etc. It was such a relief to go to the bathroom and have a dozen volunteers to hold my baby. They also had children registration so to keep the balance manageable. This mom + kid spots filled up quick.
Segregation only hurts imo, and to start segregating children out of the picture is not a good sign for humanity in general. It’s along the same idea of sticking all the old people in nursing homes. A healthy society embodies a multi-age continuum and balance.
In the case of late night parties, I agree with Meagan, most mom’s are hyper-conscious and are making the decisions that are best of them. Sure we’ve all made mistakes and said, “I’ll never go there again with baby” but spare me the judgement. We also live a flexible family style where celebrations and special events are a great opportunity to stay up late. I wouldn’t take my 4 year old to Blogher for his sake (what the heck would he do?) and I wouldn’t take my 2 year old for your sake (he’d drive everyone-me included nuts), but I would, without a second thought take an infant, in sling, everywhere, even to a late night party with glam and drinks. (Of course I would probably have to leave early with puke all over my party clothes! ;-P)
Beth, I think this part of your comment: “the reality that women as mothers are trying to balance career & family, that the private & public spheres are no longer as clear cut, and that as we move forward in today’s culture we will have more areas of business that there are going to be times moms & their children are both present in these types of settings.”
Is so true. The fact is that we can not expect women to be able to both earn a living AND mother in a way that’s satisfying and good for moms and babies if we expect children to be shuttered away all the time.
A friend of mine commented on Facebook that in the US we seem to like people to be neatly segregated into age groups: 0-3 year olds HERE, 20-40 year olds THERE, etc. We call ourselves a child-centric society but really, we create (safe, sterile, brightly-colored) artificial worlds for children to play and learn and socialize in, and deny them what they really need: to be around adults so they can learn how to be adults.
I really liked what Katie Granju had to say about my post, too, from the perspective of a working mom with children underfoot: http://mamapundit.com/2009/07/its-a-baby-in-a-bar/
I took my baby to BlogHer, and while there were some glares I really didn’t care. We did the Type-A mom party but skipped the huge cocktail thing. Some thought it was crazy, one woman even stopped me to ask if I should have that glass of wine with my baby in tow. But in the end it’s about us, what worked for my baby and what I felt comfortable with.
I agree with you. I think it is up to the mother, and not the crowd, to decide what is appropriate for her and her child. I think a lot of the hoopla about it is hypocritical. Great post.
I would like to add that some mothers do not have the option to hire a sitter. (I have never attended a conference, nor is it likely to ever happen. But I do appear in public with children). I realize this is not typical of the mothers commenting on parenting blogs, but we do exist! Please keep that in mind when you are judging mothers you see about with small children. I am low income and also do not drive. So when I go to the grocery store I have four kids in tow and we don’t have a car to go chill out in if someone gets cranky. I do my best to be considerate of others (don’t go when they’re hungry or tired, continually reminding the kids to keep voices low, move over so someone can pass us, etc.). But reality with young children, particularly more than the socially acceptable one or two kids!, is that sometimes someone melts, sometimes they fight, sometimes they forget their manners. This does not happen only at predictable times. A sitter is not an option for me, and because we walk everywhere I have less control over being able to just walk out if things get a little dicey. If someone’s melting is it better to walk all the way home without the groceries only to have to make the trip out later on? (Ocasionally yes, but most of the time no that would just make everyone more tired and more likely to act out). Not all moms have wonderful support systems, and these Moms are actually MORE LIKELY to need to get out of the house. Lack of support from jobs and our families/friends and judgement from everyone mainly hinders our ability to better care for our families and selves. Maybe the Mom out in the store late at night with her kids is out on the only day she has off from her job, or maybe she works second shift and late night is the only time she can spend with her child so they sleep in together mornings and get the same hours of sleep as a child going to bed earlier? My point is that all women do not have the same circumstances-you can’t assume that choices different than your own are always the result of negligent parenting. Standing there judging the Mom’s decision to have her children out with her doesn’t help you or her, and it feeds that negative judgemental cycle women often get stuck in. Bottom line is that both sides need to be respected and respectful.
OK, finally commenting on this one, I know a little late but I was reading it all from my phone the other night! I think you say it all so eloquently and I especially thank you for your edit there at the bottom. No matter what I’m going to consider what is best for me and baby (as I thought I was) but I need to realize for me this means that I might not do as much, and that is totally ok.
Steph
I’m blown away by the behavior and actions of some of the women who went to blogher. I’ve yet to hear any bad stories of babies pushing other babies out of the way for swag, or not talking to another baby because their blog wasn’t popular enough. Give me a break, people. I would never feel odd that someone brought a baby. I;d love to see that!
Nell
Thank you! My Sentiment Exactly. You hit the nail on the head. It is the adults carrying these babies that are the ones to blame if ever there were a problem. I won’t deny that I am far from an attachment parent. I would never have dreamed to bring a baby or child with me to BlogHer. When I arrived and saw that others had brought their babies though, it didn’t bother me. I loved getting on an elevator with a precious little one, it made my day. I think that the mother (was it you) who showed up at the Nikon party with the baby probably should have asked if the baby was invited. Not expecting them to say no of course, but just as that courtesy.
But my only issues with babies were as you said, more with the parents. I sat through a class with a baby that was fussy. Fussy enough that I had a hard time hearing the speakers because their mics weren’t working well. It took a good 4 minutes for that mother to get up and leave. That doesn’t sound long, but it is.
Just know your audience, that is all I can say.
Lee
Unfortinately, I have to politely disagree with your post. I’m a mid-20′s professional female currently without children (I do make up part of the HER still, regardless of the fact that I’ve chosen not to have children yet). You seem to think it’s a problem that many people do not approve of small babies or children “Out at parties, out at the movies, out at night, out at a conference…” etc. I am one of these people. I don’t. I prefer to spend my adult time with adults, regardless of whether the child in question at a function is specifically offending me. I think this is my choice and right – just as it was another woman’s choice and right to have said child. I think the reverse respect is true. I was once at a child’s birthday party at Chuck-e-Cheese when a group of happy-go-lucky partying-type college-aged kids entered the restaurant. They were promptly denied entry. Was this the appropriate response on the part of the restaurant? Absolutely – the restaurant’s primary goal should be to preserve the happiness and safety of it’s key demographic – children and families. The same holds true for restaurants, bars, and movie theaters. But if we want to state that individuals (and kids) act with a maturity level and behavior requisite to their age and thus are entitled to the same rights to be at parties, movies, restaurants, then these college kids should have had the right to be admitted, correct? They’re just being loud college kids, and weren’t we all college kids once? The fact of the matter is, I am sure there are many wonderful babies out there that might be able to behave through a movie, party, etc, and maybe there are many many mothers out there with the appropriate level of judgement to discern where and when to take their infant, given its disposition and typical behavior – I hope someday I am one – but there are equally as many who can’t and/or choose not to. Maybe it’s unfair that those few spoil it for the rest of mother’s, but you’ll note throughout life there’s always one that ruins it for the group – the one kid on the field trip that gets the class banned from the capital for spitting, the one teenager caught drinking who gets post-prom cancelled for everyone else, the one kid who cheats in college that requires everyone else to submit all their sources for a paper… it’s not fair, but that’s life.
I’ve heard it put that children are in a constant state of movement away from their mothers. ie. from the womb, to the arms, to the floor, up the stairs, and out the door. That first step from the womb to the arms, in my mind, is a very small one, and I tend to think of my breastfeeding newborn as an appendage or extension of my maternal body–therefore, baby goes wherever I go, and I edit my outings as necessary. That said, I’ve been to movies, poetry readings, churches, on airplanes (though never a bar) when each of my five kids were newborns, without issue. And though no one’s given me a hard time about it, I like to think that when people see that the baby is happy and quiet, they can relax. It seems like when baby moves to floor, things get complicated. I’m stressed having him out. He’s stressed to be contained in my arms, and if I have to go someplace that requires a quiet contained baby, I back out, or pump him some milk and leave him at home. Works for me. Works for the kid. I don’t really see what other people would have to complain about.
Laptops will revolutionize the country when they are accessible to everyone financially. Think of every man and women, having a personal laptop.
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